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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 12:25 am 
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I think my vote for greatest flavor gem this set as far as legendaries go, has to go to Piru.

She's just perfect: her card as whole feels like a worthy addition to the original Elders, but they put the upkeep cost to use in such a way that it actually serves a purpose gameplay-wise. That she blows up the board is just fantastic, and the reference to the Dueling Chasm in her flavortext is excellent. Art could have been better though.

Of the normal cards, I really love Tireless Provisioner. The reference toTireless Tracker is great, but the idea of this elf searching far and wide (and extending it's search erea every turn) for things to sell and food is just great.

Late to Dinner is also a favorite of mine. The ability ties so wonderfully with the story of the recently deceased Loxodon visitng his old Rhox friend as a spirit for one of their (one might imagine regular) dinners. The art by Kevin Walker is just phenomenal.

My flavorfail of the set is Urza's Saga. The abilities tell no coherent story to speak of. The thing is a jumbled mess of design ideas. The only reason it is an enchantment is so that it could get the card type 'Urza's Saga'; it serves no other purpose (funny little injokes about Urza's Saga being an enchantment set aside). The art also relates almost nothing about the story. If i were a somewhat enfranchised player that knew next to nothing about Urza's Saga...this card would not help me find out what the set is about, apart from 'artifacts'. Compare this card to Mirrodin Besieged. With Mirrodin Besieged you got what the set was about just by reading the card and looking at the art. The reference to the sieges from Khans Block was elegant and awesome.
This card is none of that. I just hate it.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 2:50 pm 
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*crawls out of vaccine-induced delirium*

Guys! Guys! We got blurbs for the old characters in this set, with new information on some of them: https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/a ... 2021-06-10

This is amazing, so let's dive into it...

Starting with the elephant in the room, we get confirmation that Svyelun of Sea and Sky "was and is a remote figure; she handed down her teachings in ancient times and has not communicated with mortals since then".
Well, on the one hand, that somewhat eases my concerns about gods being dragged into Dominaria's worldbuilding out of nowhere and the whole thing being completely D&Deified (heh).

On the other hand, this should have been enough of a reason to not print a card for her in the first place. If she's too remote to communicate with mortals or intervene at all, she's too remote to show up as a creature, too. But I guess considering the card exists and the damage is done, this clarification was probably the best way to handle this after the fact, it's not like I seriously expected a "Sorry, we screwed up!". I'm still hoping this doesn't set a precedent for more Dominarian gods being printed because "Yeah, but they are still super remote and aren't going to factor into the worldbuilding" somehow makes it okay or whatever.

Considering that Svyelun is basically confirmed to exist with this card, I'm also missing a statement about the Vodalian creation myth just being a myth, because people might mistake that for an objective fact. I'd argue that Dominaria is too 'secular' of a plane to have actual gods going around creating entire races, and I don't want this Creationist nonsense to be a part of Dominaria. I'm pretty sure that the Efravan myth about Terrent Amese having created the cat warriors can't be true for instance, because IIRC the way it's presented in Legends I would cause timeline issues and end up clashing with the fact that cat warriors were around in The Thran. It would also be kinda dumb considering most races exist on many different planes but we know from Brady that there are no gods of the multiverse that oversee the whole thing. The Ur-Dragon spawning the Elder Dragons on Dominaria is fine because it was the only way to square the information we had without any contradictions. Plus, the Ur-Dragon isn't really a god but an idea made manifest in the Blind Eternities, and we knew all along that the Elder Dragons were the first dragons, it's part of the reason they are used to be special.



"The god Tourach is said to have incarnated himself in several individuals during the ensuing centuries, including the immortal warrior Tymolin Loneglade and the Neo-Ebonic priest-king Vetro." Not liking the g-word being used in this one either, but very much liking the deep cut from Foulmere. :D

My playgroup who didn't know the story of Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar thinks it's hilarious, so I'm counting that as a win. :V

So apparently Piru, the Volatile and Chromium were the parents of Crosis, the Purger. Huh. I'll take it, Kelly already speculated in the Dominaria podcast that the Primevals are probably the first generation of dragons after the Elders, and I think it fits. (Was that even new information or was that somehow established in Chronicle of Bolas? I don't know, and I frankly don't care because I consider the whole thing to be nothing more than a terrible fanfic. Even the author stated it's up to the reader whether it's considered canon or just a myth, so... Getting the information in an article like this is fine, though. It's all good as long as they don't drag Ugin into it).

"Plunging the Blackblade into Dakkon's shadow, she bound his soul into the blade as his planeswalker spark ignited." This basically confirms Dakkon's ascension under the current "spark model" of becoming a planeswalker. Not surprising but pretty nice and probably worth mentioning.

"Dihada left Dominaria at the close of the Planeswalker War, a few years prior to the Phyrexian Invasion. The people of Dominaria believe that she still lives, for legend says that Sol'kanar will be restored to his original form upon her death, and he still rules as a demon king in Corondor to this day." :excite:

"The folk hero Garth One-Eye was born Galen of House Oor-tael in the city of Estark in Dominaria." It's actually spelled "Galin".

"At the moment he won vengeance against the killer of his kin, Garth's planeswalker spark ignited, and the Multiverse became his domain." I admit there was no perfect way to make sense of the ending of Arena under the current "spark model", but I'm pretty torn on actually giving Garth a spark. Partly because I don't like the coincidence, and partly because him being an actual Oldwalker with a spark raises the question how and why he suddenly stopped being one (both in the books and on this card that clearly depicts an older Garth with a restored eye). I guess it's possible that he gave up or snuffed out his spark and continued to planeswalk with that Thane Du Morris method that was possible before the Mending, though. I could accept that, at least it gives us something like a definite version of the events in Arena, which is more than I ever thought we'd get. It's certainly a lot better than "Yeah, whatever, this old stuff isn't canon and doesn't matter anyway", so I definitely appreciate the respect that went into this.

"Glissa was able to restore the Kaldra artifacts and grew a specialized germ creature in the flesh vats beneath the surface. Phyrexia's newest champion will either grow strong enough to rival the original Kaldra Champion in power, or it will be defeated and someone stronger will claim the artifacts. Glissa is content that, either way, Phyrexia will prevail and improve." Ah, good, I was already going to complain about this card existing, but at least someone noticed that it needs an explanation. Very much feels like that explanation was made up after the fact to cover up a continuity error, but at least we live in a world again where someone actually cares about, you know, covering up continuity errors. That's one hell of an improvement in and of itself.


So, yeah, this article was great. I think making cards for those characters and writing blurbs for them that are actually good and accurate does a lot to make older lore more accessible and to raise the chances of it being referenced again. Corondor in particular is getting some love here, and boy did it need some exposure. :thumbsup:

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 3:19 pm 
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Yeah, I'm pretty sure somebody made the Kaldra card without realizing that the Kaldra artifacts had been destroyed in The Darksteel Eye. Luckily, Glissa, the Traitor's ability to return artifact cards from the graveyard offered an easy solution to the problem! :D

Thanks for spotting the misspelling of Galin. It should be fixed soon.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:35 pm 
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WotC_Ethan wrote:
Yeah, I'm pretty sure somebody made the Kaldra card without realizing that the Kaldra artifacts had been destroyed in The Darksteel Eye. Luckily, Glissa, the Traitor's ability to return artifact cards from the graveyard offered an easy solution to the problem! :D

Thanks for spotting the misspelling of Galin. It should be fixed soon.


That is a much appreciated continuity error cover-up using some grade A Vorthos-fu, Ethan. Thanks!

Best thing I took away from this: Sol'Kanar lives! That makes me way happier than it probably should.

Also love the fact that this set clears up A) that Piru is a true Elder Dragon and that B) the primevals were the direct decendants of the Elders. No more 'lesser Elders' huzzah! (Now, to explain Sivitri Scarzam and the Scarzam Dragons.... :smirk:)

I never thought the day would come that I would no longer call anybody crazy for believing in the possibility of a Greensleeves card, but Garth made it onto cardboard, so here we are! :D


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 5:46 pm 
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Quote:
She is said to be hard at work writing The Underworld Cookbook, Volume Two, which includes a variety of methods for preparing goblin princes, dwarven councilors, and elven aristocrats for consumption, bringing a very literal meaning to the phrase "eat the rich."


In before people hate her now because she's a "communist".

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 6:24 pm 
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I just wanna say thank you to Ethan for this article as well as the people who try to makes these for each set, it really helps give all these legends a little more story and i love how the card designs get weaves into the lore.

Eh Kaldra also never bothered me since I could see Phyrexia doing artifact necromancy on already. In fact I had hope to see Living Weapon Kaldra since we last where on Mirrodin lol.

Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar is just delightful and I hope we see The Underworld Cookbook, Volume Two (and food in general).

I do like the are leaving the first planeswalker war up in the air, might be fun to bring it back someday but I'd like to wait for them to able to really focus on it and these little updates and hints are fun enough for speculation and leaves things open enough. Might be a cool thing to explore in core set before maybe bring back someone of these characters like Dihada is hinted to be around.

That said I'm more excited for tomorrow to learn about Grist, I find them/it delightful in a horrific way and I wanted to know about them/it!


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 6:29 pm 
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Quote:
She is said to be hard at work writing The Underworld Cookbook, Volume Two, which includes a variety of methods for preparing goblin princes, dwarven councilors, and elven aristocrats for consumption, bringing a very literal meaning to the phrase "eat the rich."


In before people hate her now because she's a "communist".

Yeah, that'd be a very tone deaf read.
"Communists" don't have any exclusivity on hating the oligarchy. I shan't dive further down that rabbit hole.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:10 pm 
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For the record, Asmor had made the appropriate measures to feed Vincent.... Just, the wind shifted and her wasps flew away.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:33 pm 
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She is said to be hard at work writing The Underworld Cookbook, Volume Two, which includes a variety of methods for preparing goblin princes, dwarven councilors, and elven aristocrats for consumption, bringing a very literal meaning to the phrase "eat the rich."


In before people hate her now because she's a "communist".

Nah, only a devoted monarchist could recognize the superior taste of nobility.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:44 am 
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The other legends are more or less what you'd expect. Not a lot of info is given on Grist, but it does have a creepy nursery rhyme.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:29 am 
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The other legends are more or less what you'd expect. Not a lot of info is given on Grist, but it does have a creepy nursery rhyme.


I love it and maybe I'm reading more into it but the nursery rhythm seems too be from the point of view of the bugs that make the spawn hinting that Grist might be a "queen" who makes a swarm body as it travels, maybe extending its spark to the whole body in the way its seems Wrenn can to her tree folk mecha.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:35 am 
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So, since Chromium and Piru have been confirmed as Crosis' parents, I guess that means Vaevictis Asmadi is Darigaaz' father, right? Because apparently the Core 19 Player's Guide calls him the sire of the Shivan Dragons, and Darigaaz is both a Shivan Dragon and a Primeval, so... I'm fine with that as well, it adds something to the original lore without contradicting it or relying on any of the blatant retcons from Core 19. Let's hope it'll stay that way if the Primevals ever become relevant again.


WotC_Ethan wrote:
Thanks for spotting the misspelling of Galin. It should be fixed soon.
Huh, cool, I didn't even expect it to actually be fixed, but more power to you! :thumbsup:


Edit:
Vaevictis wrote:
(Now, to explain Sivitri Scarzam and the Scarzam Dragons.... :smirk:)
Well, not that it really explains anything, but if you want to make up your own conspiracy theories: There is/was a town called Scarza in Sarpadia, it's mentioned on p. 284 of And Peace Shall Sleep...

Vaevictis wrote:
I never thought the day would come that I would no longer call anybody crazy for believing in the possibility of a Greensleeves card, but Garth made it onto cardboard, so here we are! :D
Loot Niptil or bust! :-P There's amazing new flavourtext by Greensleeves in this set, though. That makes me very happy.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 2:23 pm 
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So, since Chromium and Piru have been confirmed as Crosis' parents, I guess that means Vaevictis Asmadi is Darigaaz' father, right? Because apparently the Core 19 Player's Guide calls him the sire of the Shivan Dragons, and Darigaaz is both a Shivan Dragon and a Primeval, so... I'm fine with that as well, it adds something to the original lore without contradicting it or relying on any of the blatant retcons from Core 19. Let's hope it'll stay that way if the Primevals ever become relevant again.


WotC_Ethan wrote:
Thanks for spotting the misspelling of Galin. It should be fixed soon.
Huh, cool, I didn't even expect it to actually be fixed, but more power to you! :thumbsup:


Edit:
Vaevictis wrote:
(Now, to explain Sivitri Scarzam and the Scarzam Dragons.... :smirk:)
Well, not that it really explains anything, but if you want to make up your own conspiracy theories: There is/was a town called Scarza in Sarpadia, it's mentioned on p. 284 of And Peace Shall Sleep...

Vaevictis wrote:
I never thought the day would come that I would no longer call anybody crazy for believing in the possibility of a Greensleeves card, but Garth made it onto cardboard, so here we are! :D
Loot Niptil or bust! :-P There's amazing new flavourtext by Greensleeves in this set, though. That makes me very happy.



1. Anthologies for the win!

2. Scarza is cool, but i'm still confused about Scarzam and her dragons...:p

3. I also believe that it implies that Vaevictis is the father of the OG Darigaaz. I love it as it deepens the background for both the Elders and the primevals. Very cool stuff.

Overal the background and lore references have been respectful and on point, while some blurbs even expend some of our knowledge. It's awesome. Love this set.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:21 am 
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You know what I just realized after having read the design story behind Urza Saga?

Dwarven Mine is NOT a Mine, despite that being a viable subtype. Equally Tower and Power-plant are never used.
.... I call bull ****!

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 6:20 am 
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https://geekculture.co/magic-the-gather ... sted-dish/

Thought this might be fun to share.
In the past, I've tried to recreate dishes like Wurm Stew or the golden reduction from Suderbod as well, but without great success.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:23 pm 
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Vaevictis wrote:
All the UB stuff an D&D crossover stuff...I just won't look it over. And I know thst I'm probably a horrible person for saving this, but I will refuse to play against anyone using those cards. Not because I'll hold something against that individual for using those cards; to each their own, but because I won't enjoy a game playing against those cards...in fact I'm pretty sure I'll thoroughly hate it.
That's basically where I stand on this as well. The D&D set has caused several discussions to flare up in my playgroup, and I guess I might not realistically be able to avoid all cards from it entirely if I ever want to play Magic again, but I'll definitely refuse to play against EDH decks that run cards from other IPs as their Commander, even if that means we'll end up splitting our game nights between real Magic and Dungeons: The Dragoning and I'll only show up for real Magic.

A friend and I picked up a MH2 booster box to share and draft with, but it kinda feels like a farewell-set, basically the last time I'll be able to enjoy a proper Magic experience before the D&D set comes out and ruins it (well, it and the other IPs that will follow). If we really end up splitting game nights, that'll lead to me playing less Magic overall, and not being able to avoid certain cards from other IPs when I still do play Magic is probably going to have at least some impact on my enjoyment, so either way I'll end up spending less money on Magic in the future. Innistrad is my second favourite plane for instance, but I just can't bring myself to care about the two upcoming sets right now. Magic has done a lot of things to piss me off over the years, but very little of that actually mattered as soon as I'd sit down to play the game. Injecting other IPs into Magic is going to change that, however. Who knows, maybe I'll completely retreat into Cube building and never look back if the outside influences in Magic grow too strong.
___________________________________________________

I've finally found the time to comment on a few more cards (some of them are complaints or nitpicks, admittedly, but those just stand out more, I don't have any complaints about the vast majority of cards in this set):

Looking at MH2, I was hit by the most important Vorthos question that nobody's asking: Does Floodhound smell of wet dog? :wizard:

I kinda dislike the execution of Rishadan Dockhand. For starters, all other Rishadans have the Pirate type, but this one doesn't, and that just stands out in a Time Spiral like set full of references. The art does nothing to evoke Mercadian merfolk either (although those can be a bit all over the place), it looks more like the merfolk from, say, Zendikar (compare Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper for instance). Which is really a shame when Mercadia has some cool and very distinct looking merfolk cards like Saprazzan Heir.

I hate that Cabal Initiate is a Warlock and not a Cleric. Then again, I hate all Warlocks for being Warlocks, but it's especially bothersome on creatures from Dominaria and other oldschool planes.

Vermin Gorger is at odds with the info established in the Planeswalker's Guide to Innistrad: "A vampire will starve to death in one full cycle of the moon unless it drinks as much human blood as an average human contains (about five liters). [...] Because of the source magic that created all vampires, only blood from a living human will suffice. Vampire alchemists have attempted transmutations of animal blood to human blood, but all have failed."
https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/a ... 2011-11-02
Granted, we've seen Sorin drink blood from other humanoids, and we also know that Innistrad's elves were hunted to extinction by the vampires precisely because their blood was so tasty. Maybe the blood of most other humanoids is similar enough to human blood to be of some use to Innistrad's vampires, but animal blood clearly isn't. Then again, maybe Vermin Gorger just has really bad taste or a strange form of madness that makes him drink the blood of rats even though he doesn't get any nutrition from it. Who knows, maybe this is even intended as a deliberate piece of foreshadowing that something's wrong on Innistrad (again)...

The new artwork on Patriarch's Bidding is a bit of an odd fit, but seeing werewolves on a black card again is a direction I approve of. Still hoping for some :b::g: werewolves from Dominaria's Northland one day...

Blessed Respite has amazing flavourtext by Greensleeves <3 The art is a nod to Gaea's Blessing, which is also cool.

Sanctum Weaver should be a Nymph Dryad like all the other Dryads from Theros. I can buy Sythis, Harvest's Hand not having more space on the type line, but Sanctum Weaver has no excuse. Then again, I've been arguing for abolishing the Dryad type and making everything a Nymph for years. Shanodin Dryads was originally printed as a Nymph after all, and there are water nymphs in Yavimaya, so there is still some room to grow for Nymphs in other colours.

Getting flavourtext by Wasitora on Smell Fear (and her paws in the art) is great and all, but it's kinda odd that the art shows a generic white guy. Not impossible, all things considered, but it would have made a lot more sense for Wasitora to encounter people from Madara or Suq'Ata, and we haven't seen any of those in card art for ages.

Urza's Saga is terrible on pretty much every level. I already complained about the artwork in the Spoiler Room, but I can't stand the card design either. More precisely, I hate that they made this an Enchantment Land. How can a Saga also be a land? Maybe I could have bought it for Sagas that are tied to a particular place, like History of Benalia or The First Eruption, but Urza's Saga, the one story that basically stretches across the entire globe and spans millenia? Boo. "Urza's" was a stupid type to begin with*, but this "haha, look how witty I am" kind of design takes the cake. A stupid pun isn't worth a card design, at least not at Rare.

*Like, why is Urza's Factory not a Factory when Urza's Tower is a Tower etc.? And I get that there is an Urzatron but no Mishratron, but they could have made "Mishra's" a type as well, Mishra's Factory and Mishra's Workshop are a thing after all... Also, what Barinellos said. That said, would be cool if they made a trio of Mishra lands that do something different than just producing more mana. Maybe create Assembly-Worker tokens?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 6:13 pm 
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I was pretty shocked to see that "Urza's" was a card type. Especially weird considering how many cards have "Urza's" in the name, but don't get the type.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 6:27 pm 
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TPmanW wrote:
I was pretty shocked to see that "Urza's" was a card type. Especially weird considering how many cards have "Urza's" in the name, but don't get the type.

It really just exists to shorten the wording on the tron lands. (So they don't have to say "a land named Urza's Tower, a land named Urza's Power-Plant, etc".) The way subtypes work in Magic, it had to be exclusive to lands, so it can't just show up on random artifacts even if they wanted it to. It does show up on all five lands that have "Urza's" in the name! But since there are no cards that generically care about land types so far, the type has no mechanical relevance on Urza's Factory and Urza's Saga.

Edit: Apparently there is a card that lets you choose a non-basic land type! (See below.) I had no idea.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 7:21 pm 
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Well, there is traveler's cloak to give Urza'swalk.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 7:32 pm 
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Barinellos wrote:
Well, there is traveler's cloak to give Urza'swalk.

Wow, that card doesn't specify that it has to be a basic land type. Huh. I never noticed that.

Apparently there are a few other cards that let you choose a land type as well. For some reason I thought that didn't exist yet.

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