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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 3:31 pm 
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Congrats, still lazing around at 2800 MMR, but having fun with fun decks. Most recently with a wild hunt ship deck.

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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 1:20 am 
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Lol Wild Hunt Ship deck. That's epic. I remember reading about this deck that played Nekker Warriors to put Ships back into the deck and then pulled them out with Navigators, but boy - that's so extremely gimmicky and fragile. Each Vrihedd Vanguard is the same +1 boost to all units, except it's permanent.

Also I'm desperately trying to figure out the last gold slot for my deck. Currently the ones I'm using are Ithlinne, Iorveth: Meditation and Isengrim: Outlaw. Golds I've tried, tested and have serious doubts about:

Saskia - this card has a high ceiling but also conflicts with Francesca. The reasons are subtle. I want to use Saskia to mulligan into Vanguards, and then have Officers in hand to mulligan away those Vanguards. But Officers can mulligan into bad cards (Alzur's Thunder / Tremors for Ithlinne especially) so I also want to have Francesca available. But that means I can't use Francesca to search for Saskia. If I know I'll be in a long round then yes Saskia can be great, but otherwise it's just not very good.
Schirru - I'm already using Scorch. Adding Schirru is too many anti-big unit effects. I did consider swapping out Scorch for Mandrake and then using Schirru anyway, don't remember clearly why I rejected that idea, but probably something to do with the effect being overkill. Mulligan also creates some pretty-big units, and Schirru can be dead as a result.
Isengrim - Stresses mulligan, and not easy to spare a silver slot in my current list for an ambush unit.
Renew - slightly lower ceiling than Saskia but significantly more versatile. Two main problems: if opponent and I go direct to a long round 3, then Renew can be dead. The only gold card I can use freely is Isengrim: Outlaw, since the other two are rather situational, but using Isengrim: Outlaw early has its costs (in particular, I can't spawn another Ida vs. weather, and cannot tutor up Summoning Circle if opponent has a spy). The other problem is that searching for Renew wastes Francesca's +3 buff.
Aglais - excellent vs. some decks, almost dead vs. certain others. I originally thought it was just spies in which case I figured I can risk it, but then I realized that it's also dead vs. Skellige. Yes they run Restore, but Restore only works on Skellige units.
Iorveth - if it were 5 strength dealing 9 damage, maybe. As it is, there're too many cards it can't kill (Knight Elect, Trebuchet, Light Longship ...). That's not counting the fact that Iorveth's handbuff doesn't get full value since Vanguards typically don't get played.

I'm out of ideas ... I want to add something that can help me beat consume, and isn't dead in other matchups, but there doesn't appear to be such a card.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:26 pm 
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Banedon wrote:
Lol Wild Hunt Ship deck. That's epic. I remember reading about this deck that played Nekker Warriors to put Ships back into the deck and then pulled them out with Navigators, but boy - that's so extremely gimmicky and fragile. Each Vrihedd Vanguard is the same +1 boost to all units, except it's permanent.


Well, that's what I've been using and I even won against a dwarf deck yesterday (not indicative of the deck's power ofc). Not only Navigators but Slyzards too.

Avallac'h
Ge'els
G:Igni
Yennefer

Frightener
Operator
Last Wish
Decoy
ADC
Marching Orders

3x Nekker Warriors
3x Drakkars
3x Navigator
3x Slyzard
3x Recon

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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:13 pm 
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With this kind of list though do you have enough WH units to make it work? You only have ships and Navigators. I'd be looking at dropping some Slyzards / Nekker Warriors and adding idk, WH Warriors, Caranthir, Nithral, maybe Imlerith.

Also why Last Wish? Just run Roach if you're after thinning and can spare a silver slot. ADC + Marching Orders also sounds extreme, since you can't guarantee either Navigator or Slyzard. Pulling Frightener with ADC is generally bad since it makes it worth more than a counterspy. Also dubious about Decoy since the Decoy-able units don't provide that much value.

Could consider Woodland Spirit + a Foglet since you have Yennefer anyway, Commander's Horn is also good in the current meta since row hate is rare.

EDIT: Oh boy, I only have to think about playing Gwent and my heart rate increases. Wtf!
EDIT #2: Damn, game is hard. I had a large advantage one game and then my opponent played Dragon's Dream. I proceeded to "clear" it with Ida (bad idea - that actually triggers the hazard). I still might've been able to recover, but then I proceeded to misclick a mulligan. Tilt begets tilt damnit. Still, at 4274 MMR now, likely a personal record especially this early in the season!
EDIT #3: 4313 and top 200. Man, I'm earning this.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:11 am 
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Lol I just beat jointime on stream :D

It was a frustrating game - in the mulligan vs. spies matchup, he won the coinflip, against which I usually drypass round one. If he had lost the coinflip I'd have been extremely confident - tempoing out spies when they go first is so easy. I was especially incentivized to drypass round 1 since I was holding another Wardancer. But then in round 2, he had both Summoning Circle and Cantarella, and he was playing Emhyr. That let him play three spies vs. my two (= full bleed) and stack them on the same row for Igni. After losing the spy war I was so frustrated I was considering conceding, even thinking things like "if I'd tuned into his stream and saw he was holding SC + Cantarella, maybe I wouldn't have dry passed round 1". But this high up the ladder each MMR was precious so I made him play it out.

Fortune blessed my Elven Scout with a Dwarven Mercenary, which saved one Cantarella. Possibly angry as well, he pushed the round too long, too hard, using up all his win conditions while I simply had no lack of points. Each one of his high tempo plays looked impressive, but I was always able to match it with my own. Near the end of the round I was a bit concerned since he could pass and my hand would be suddenly much weaker - I had cards like Ithlinne with only Tremors to cast, Iorveth: Meditation, and so on. But he played out everything presumably because his hand was also weak in short rounds (Menno, Yenn: Enchantress). That was really good for me and I won the round by a full 24 points. I tuned in to his stream and while I don't speak Russian, I did hear him say "and that was when he knew he **** up", which sums up round 2.

We went into a round 3 topdeck war and I drew Half-Elf Hunter, which beat his Infiltrator. gg!

4350 MMR now, I'll make it to GM yet!


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 11:15 am 
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I'm like 20 games under .500 right now lol

I've been brutal this season

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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:04 pm 
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Brutally handsome

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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:32 pm 
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dawww

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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:47 am 
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Damn I reached like 4374 MMR and top 100, then went on a losing streak. I feel like most of the losses weren't due to poor play on my part as well. There was even one striking game vs. spies where I won the coinflip, won round 1 on equal cards, drypassed round 2, went into a very long round 3, and I still lost. It was by only one point, but I didn't give up any serious value (like 25+ point Ignis) and had my own value engine going as well (Ida's Fog did over 20 damage). In retrospect him being able to play out all his spies and then only the Enforcers might've generated too much value to overcome.

Or maybe I just need a better deck. Scorch is perhaps the worst card in my deck right now, although it's still very powerful against certain decks. I dunno. The game is hard.

EDIT: I notice I'm going into round 3 up a card vs. Skellige but still lose quite a bit. Is there any single card that can help in that matchup?


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:47 pm 
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Banedon wrote:
Damn I reached like 4374 MMR and top 100, then went on a losing streak. I feel like most of the losses weren't due to poor play on my part as well. There was even one striking game vs. spies where I won the coinflip, won round 1 on equal cards, drypassed round 2, went into a very long round 3, and I still lost. It was by only one point, but I didn't give up any serious value (like 25+ point Ignis) and had my own value engine going as well (Ida's Fog did over 20 damage). In retrospect him being able to play out all his spies and then only the Enforcers might've generated too much value to overcome.

Or maybe I just need a better deck. Scorch is perhaps the worst card in my deck right now, although it's still very powerful against certain decks. I dunno. The game is hard.

EDIT: I notice I'm going into round 3 up a card vs. Skellige but still lose quite a bit. Is there any single card that can help in that matchup?


What flavor of Skellige?

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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:05 pm 
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Bran with Cerys Morkvarg Olgierd, especially if I lose the coin flip. Problem is if I win round 1, I can't drypass round 2 since their carryover > mine. If I lose round 1, they bleed round 2 until only a few cards left, and even if I go into round 3 up a card they win courtesy of Cerys + Olgierd / Morkvarg + Sigrdrifa into Skjall into Maruaders. Priestess of Freya resurrecting an 8-strength Beastnaster is also deadly. They generate so many points that Scorch being worth 19 points doesn't feel enough.

It's possible I'm playing the matchup wrong. Their deck is synergy-driven and needs to have cursed units on the board for example, so a way to beat it could be to push a round until they have enough cursed units to make Marauders really good, and then pass. However, my deck is also synergy-driven.

What have you been doing vs that?


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:03 am 
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Long post below about the state of my mulligan deck. I made top 100 with this list, but have since crashed out and can't get back in. RIP. If anyone has any ideas please share, otherwise I'm just putting this out here ...

Pros and cons
+ Fairly consistent. There's a chance the RNG wrecks you by giving you Tremors Aeliren etc of course, but Francesca + the fact that mulligan sees a lot of cards often means you'll get to use all your golds in a game.
+ Best Ithlinne / Tremors deck.
+ Good matchup vs. Dwarves. It's by no means a crush, but I'd say mulligan is favoured simply because Ithlinne Tremors is so good vs. them, and this deck is virtually guaranteed to be able to cast that.
+ There's a chance of winning any matchup simply by winning the coinflip + opening with a Wardancer + having the spy wars package in hand.
- Bad matchup vs. Consume especially if losing the coinflip. Almost unwinnable. On the other hand I don't know if anything beats consume without specific tech cards + if they lose the coin flip.
- Weak in short rounds. I've lost plenty of games going into round 3 up a card.
? Simple (and possibly boring) play: play Half-elf Hunter, then Elven Scout, then Officers.

Francesca

Bronzes:
Core cards
2x Wardancers - great to prevent drypasses. I usually use one in round 1 just in case I win the coin flip; then I use the other in round 2 or 3.
3x Elven Scout - super value bronze, small wonder it's getting nerfed next patch.
2x Half-elf Hunter - 12 points, 2 (elf) bodies. Great value. I put 2x here since there's a small space issue. 3x is very possible.
3x Vrihedd Vanguard - core mulligan engine
3x Vrihedd Officer - core mulligan engine
1x Tremors - Francesca makes for the best Ithlinne deck since it will always be able to access Ithlinne (an Ithlinne with spells to cast too). This card is core

Other considerations
1x Alzur's Thunder - this card is frustrating because it's great against some decks (reveal, NR armor comes to mind) but is also a bad card to draw. Mulligan decks see lots of cards so there's a good chance I draw it. Since Officers no longer buff themselves if mulliganing spells this is a problem.

Silvers:
Core cards
1x Aelirenn - provides critical tempo boost. Often the only way to keep up with dwarves until Vanguards start getting mulliganed.
1x Yaevinn - part of spy wars package.
1x Summoning Circle - per above.
1x Ida - I've never cut her. Provides interaction, weather clear, and in a long round, fog.

Other considerations
1x Hattori - mitigates the "weak if bled" weakness somewhat. Hattori into Elven Scout is by no means a good win condition, but it's better than nothing.
1x Decoy - generically good card. I conceived of this + Hattori as twice the win condition, but it's not reliable.
1x Commander's Horn - 20 points for a silver is great.
1x Scorch - this deck's units don't get that big. Lots of decks make bigger (spies, Cursed Skellige, even dwarves).

Each spell that's run weakens the deck vs. Aglais.

Bad cards
1x Eleyas - I don't see why anyone would run this. Your Officers have better things to do than mulligan Eleyas. It's not even that strong a win condition - 18 points? Ithlinne casting 2x Alzur's Thunder is worth more than that.

Golds:
Core cards
1x Ithlinne - I consider Ithlinne the strongest gold in the game.
1x Iorveth: Meditation - possibly the 2nd strongest gold in the game. Usually provides a great amount of points.

Other considerations
1x Geralt: Igni - usually solid but hard to get really good value at top MMR. On the other hand Yaevinn into Summoning Circle into Geralt: Igni is pretty good.
1x Aglais - useless vs. spies, Skellige & reveal, great vs. everything else.
1x Isengrim: Outlaw - a very consistent gold. Tutors for silver spells -> helps win the spy war. Occasionally acts as a 2nd Ida vs. gold weather, or brings out Hattori for more points.
1x Renew - double Ithlinne or Iorveth: Meditation is great. Not so great is that they actually have to end up in the graveyard first.
1x Ciri: Nova - don't have enough experience to say for sure. C:N solves the "getting bled" problem but the deckbuilding costs involved is very high. Not only do you have to cut on the core bronzes, you have to add a 2nd Tremors for Ithlinne.

Bad cards
Iorveth - doesn't kill enough cards. Trebuchet doesn't die, Knight-Elect doesn't die, Vrihedd Dragoon doesn't die ...
Saskia - the reason is subtle. Point is you want to save Francesca until all the Officers have been used, just so you can mulligan away bad cards that might be drawn. But that means you can't use Francesca to tutor for Saskia in the mid-game, when Saskia is at her best. Saskia is also weak if you don't have Vanguards to mulligan away. I am not certain Saskia is bad, but I have not had good experiences using her.

Play notes

*Always play Half-elf Hunter before Elven Scout, since it enables Elven Healer. Preferably play Elven Scout after the opponent has a unit as well, since it enables Panther, Swordmaster, etc.
*Elven Scout can bring a variety of useful bronzes, e.g. Healer to get your units out of Ithlinne range, Brigade for weather clear, Defender for carryover, Panther to kill Enforcers, etc.
*If you get Farseer, each Officer will buff her. Dragoon is not as effective as it usually is since it might buff a Vanguard that never sees play. All things equal, Hawker Support should buff Wardancer to win carryover wars, or 2-strength units to stay out of Ithlinne-Tremors range.
*Officers mulliganing a Vanguard are worth 12 points each + 1 for each elf ally. After all your setup is done, each one of these can be over 20 points.
*Francesca mulliganing a Vanguard DOES NOT trigger the +1 buff on Francesca. A bug, but not fixed yet.
*Iorveth: Meditation value chart - https://www.reddit.com/r/gwent/comments ... readsheet/
*This deck often goes into the last few turns wondering what to play around, since a lot of the cards get better as the round goes on. You'll have to decide the sequence.
*The deck is really good in long rounds. If both you and the opponent drypass round 1 I fancy this deck vs. everyone (except possibly Axemen, but if you can keep the Axemen off the board you're in good shape).
*Up until recently I liked drypassing round 1 if I lose the coinflip. I am still not sure if this is a good strategy against many decks (it's certainly a bad strategy vs. spies & axemen). If I win the coin flip, I play to win on even cards.
*The deck doesn't have any big units other than Officers. Anyone saving stuff like Coral or Iorveth: Meditation for round 3 is in for a rude shock.
*Place biggest units on the sides. Nobody's running Milaen, and doing this lets you stagger Commander's Horn better. But be careful vs. spies since Enforcers can shoot down the biggest unit to enable Igni value.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 4:50 pm 
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Well too bad - didn't see the announcement that the ranked season was ending and didn't make it to GM. Can't complain though, I'd probably not have made it with mulligan and don't have the experience with any other archetype. I peaked at ~4450 with mulligan and I guess that was still something to be happy about.

Don't know if mulligan will survive the balance patch. Losing the uber-powerful golds is bound to be a massive hit. The only consolation is that the other decks are also going to lose power. I guess we'll see.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:48 pm 
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Patch is live.

Quote:
NEUTRAL
Yennefer: Conjurer's power changed from 9 to 10.
Avallac'h: Sage's power changed from 2 to 3.
Ale of the Ancestors' power changed from 9 to 10.
Commander's Horn's boost value changed from 4 to 3.
Summoning Circle will no longer Spawn copies of Agents.
Stammelford's Tremors will no longer Spawn a Lesser Guardian.
Removed the Organic category from Doppler.
Ciri: Nova will now set base power to 22 instead of 25.
Avallac'h now has the Doomed category.

MONSTERS
Nithral will now deal 6 damage to an enemy and an additional 1 damage for each Wild Hunt unit in the player's hand.
Ifrit's power changed from 7 to 8.
Caranthir Ar-Feiniel's power changed from 8 to 9.
Whispering Hillock's power changed from 5 to 6.
Bridge Troll's power changed from 9 to 10.
Morvudd's power changed from 5 to 6.
Unseen Elder's power changed from 4 to 5.
Striga's power changed from 5 to 6.
Kayran's power changed from 6 to 5.
Kayran will now consume a unit with 7 power or less and boost self by its power.
Slyzard's power changed from 3 to 2.
Monster Nest now boosts by 1, not by 3.

SKELLIGE
Yoana will now only heal allies.
Yoana will now also heal Gold units.
Champion of Hov can now Duel any enemy.
An Craite Greatsword's power changed from 7 to 8.
Eist Tuirseach's power changed from 4 to 5.
Ulfhedinn's power changed from 5 to 6.
Heymaey Flaminica's power changed from 9 to 10.
Heymaey Skald's power changed from 8 to 9.
Bone Talisman will no longer boost the Resurrected Beast and Cultist units.
Hym's power changed from 4 to 3.
Berserker Marauder's ability will no longer trigger twice if an ally is both Cursed and damaged.
Restore will now add the Doomed category to the unit returned to hand.

NORTHERN REALMS
Removed the Doomed category from Kaedweni Revenant. Only copies of Kaedweni Revenant will appear with the Doomed category.
Vincent Meis' power changed from 8 to 9.
Reaver Hunter's power changed from 5 to 6.
Ves' power changed from 11 to 12.
Field Medic's power changed from 6 to 8.
Seltkirk of Gulet's power changed from 7 to 8.
Shani's power changed from 5 to 4.

SCOIA'TAEL
Pavko Gale now allows the player to choose which Bronze or Silver Item to play from the deck.
Dwarven Mercenary's power changed from 7 to 8.
Dwarven Mercenary's boost value changed from 4 to 3.
Yarpen Zigrin's power changed from 7 to 8.
Morenn's power changed from 9 to 8.
Morenn's damage value changed from 5 to 7.
Filavandrel's power changed from 3 to 4.
Iorveth's power changed from 7 to 6.
Iorveth's damage value changed from 7 to 8.
Aglaïs' power changed from 9 to 8.
Aglaïs will now Banish the Resurrected card.
Iorveth: Meditation can now only force 2 enemies on the same row to Duel.
Dwarven Skirmisher will now boost instead of Strengthen.
Dwarven Agitator's power changed from 2 to 1.
Mahakam Guard's power changed from 9 to 4.
Mahakam Guard's boost value changed from 3 to 7.
Elven Scout's power changed from 2 to 1.
Half-Elf Hunter's Spawned copy will now have the Doomed category.

NILFGAARD
Impera Enforcers now deal 2 damage to an enemy when played and deal 2 damage to an enemy whenever a Spying enemy appears during your turn.
Treason will now force two adjacent enemies to Duel each other.
Rot Tosser's power changed from 7 to 8.
Slave Driver will now also display copies of the same card in the choice screen.
Slave Driver's power changed from 2 to 1.
Slave Infantry's Spawned copies will now have the Doomed category.
Ointment will now only Resurrect a Bronze unit with 5 power or less.


First impressions -

Still no fix to coin flip :(
It's a good thing there's no more Summoning Circle spy wars, but still, I dislike spy wars in general.
Lol they really don't like mill.
Yenn: Con could be good now - 10 strength means it's out of range of Alzur's Thunder. I was seriously considering running her last patch since the only real way for dwarves to kill her is with Iorveth: Meditation; then someone pointed out that Alzur's Thunder also does it.
RIP Commander's Horn. 15 points that requires 5 units isn't worth it for a silver.
I like the nerf to Restore. It was virtually auto-include in all Skellige decks.
Dwarves still look really good. Agitator spawning Skirmisher is still 13 points. Barclay wasn't nerfed either.

Next deck I'm thinking of is some kind of play "Yen: Con, defend her" deck, with stuff like Mahakam Guard (probably not ...) or Yoana. Ulfhedinn looks like a very strong combo with her as well. Only problem with decks of this kind is, how can I ensure a long round for her to generate value ... maybe with Renew?


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:56 am 
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Banedon wrote:
But do you prefer fair or unfair decks? If you go to a legacy tournament, are you more likely to be running 4c Leovold or ANT?

Also, currently 4170 MMR top 1000 with my mulligan deck. Wondering if that's good enough to post it :D Going even higher is ... stressful ... whatever Barney might say about fear of losing, fact is I can't fully conquer it. Even before starting a game, my heart rate would show a noticeable increase. Game's hard.

Depends on your definition of Fair and Unfair. Anything within the rules of the game is Fair.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:50 pm 
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Brief thoughts on Yen: Con deck - she's a neutral gold, which means any deck can conceivably run her. Thinking of synergies ...

NG - can exclude this faction. No heal cards and no synergies.
Monsters - can exclude this too. No heal cards and no synergies.
ST - Elven Healer and Mahakam Guard can heal. Elven Archer can help align units for Yenn: Con. No other synergies.
SK - Axemen was the traditional Yenn: Con deck. Ulfhedin is also a good combo with Yenn: Con. Problem is, in today's world, Axemen already has lots of strong golds (2x gold weather, Avallach, Birna, Ulfhedin). I am not sure how well Yenn: Con goes with these cards, especially since Skellige Storm / RNR are probably counter-synergistic with Yenn: Con. SK also has few heal cards.
NR - Ballisa + Yenn: Con should be pretty epic. I don't understand how machine decks work however, and it should be imperative for the deck to be able to knock the strongest enemies into multi-hit range. Anyone familiar with NR machines? The machines deck doesn't run heal cards, which could be a problem. The alternative is armor (Thunderbolt potion counts) but armor decks don't interact with the opponent -> Yen might not generate much value.

I'm thinking of a machines deck with ballistas and Aedirnian Maulers, idk.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:28 am 
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Well, reached GM with Axemen. It's quite a frustrating deck though because its matchups are so polarized. If the opponent doesn't have counters I usually win easily, but if they do, I get annihilated. Decks with Mandrake + Eithne + Schirru, or 3x bronze weather clear + silver mage, those games are over from the load screen. The deck is also linear enough that I've mostly been playing on autopilot.
It's not exactly fair - reaching top 100 last season with mulligan (which didn't even reach GM) was a lot harder than reaching GM this season with Axemen. I'm strongly considering putting Axemen down for these reasons.

Any suggestions for another deck to play? I absolutely do NOT want to play coin flip elves (that deck should be nerfed out of existence). I sort of want to play with Succubus or whatever she renamed to, but Eredin seems pretty bad right now.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:53 pm 
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Posts: 518
New patch, arena mode, 10 new cards.

I'm giving some serious thought to playing something with Imlerith: Sabbath. The card appears very polarizing. Sometimes it's just going to die to Alzur's Thunder, but if it sticks it can be defended with Mandrake and Renew, and then it's virtually unbeatable. It might even be something to play with Yenn: Con which I never really seriously experimented with last patch. Something like Yenn: Con, Renew, Imlerith: Sabbath, Royal Decree - it's a lot of eggs invested in the two gold cards, but what the hell.


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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:16 pm 
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Location: Newfoundland
Gwent is dead to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Gwent
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:36 pm 
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Yay! We’re going to win Hakeem back to another game! Prominence Poker maybe? Magic 2014?

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There's a limited amount of fun to be had in a single game, and this deck will ensure no one has any of it.


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