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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2020 4:44 pm 
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And my first 7-win draft of the format goes to... Rakdos Party Aggro!

2 x Expedition Skulker
2 x Malakir Blood Priest
2 x Grotag Bug-Catcher
1 x Magmatic Channeler
1 x Roil Eruption

1 x Demon's Disciple
3 x Ardent Electromancer
2 x Vanquish the Weak
2 x Ravager's Mace

1 x Scorch Rider

1 x Deadly Alliance
1 x Synchronized Spellcraft
1 x Song-Mad Treachery

1 x Drana's Silencer
1 x Thwart the Grave
1 x Shatterskull Minotaur
1 x Sea Gate Colossus

8 x Swamp
8 x Mountain


Get (most of) a party together, then use Electromancer and cost reduction to vomit stuff out on the board; use Ravager's Mace or removal when appropriate.


EDIT: And a 7-1 in Sealed as well (deck's a lot less about party and a lot more about grinding though)

1 x Malakir Rebirth
1 x Spikefield Hazard

1 x Acquisitions Expert
2 x Expedition Skulker
2 x Fissure Wizard
1 x Grotag Bug-Catcher
1 x Kargan Intimidator
1 x Magmatic Channeler
1 x Teeterpeak Ambusher
1 x Subtle Strike
1 x Thundering Rebuke

1 x Expedition Champion
2 x Grotag Night-Runner
1 x Kazul's Fury
1 x Molten Blast
1 x Valakut Exploration

1 x Scorch Rider
1 x Spitfire Lagac
1 x Blood Price
1 x Hagra Mauling

2 x Pyroclastic Hellion
1 x Deadly Alliance

7 x Swamp
7 x Mountain

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:49 pm 
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That's close to what my thoughts were.
0-3 is a straight swap out. 17 or 18 lands depending on curve
4+ you swap them out 2 for 1 and run about 19 or 20 lands, 21+ if you hit magic cristmas land and get 8 which I assume will be near impossible once people start catching on.


I'm 1-1 with sealed. Will bust out a few cheap Quick Drafts to get a feel for the format before I spend my free tokens on the better prizes in Premier Draft.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:17 pm 
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Got 7-2 with my first draft in ZNR.

Image

The format seems moderately slow. A solid aggro can appear, but I think boards get stalled out which make party really solid synergy, the incidental life gain useful for racing, and evasion stronger so far.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 7:45 am 
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Banedon wrote:
First draft, I P2P1'ed the mythic colorless artifact and then never saw anything that taps for colorless. Is that card even playable?


There are 3 lands that tap for colorless, but 2 are rares. It’s a constructed card. I suppose it’s possible to draft a deck where it’s playable (lord effect, little ramp and lifegain), but that seems suuuuuper fringe with the set’s pool and I can’t see myself taking it for anything other than collection building.


What did you lose to?

I don’t think your pool looks awful, but I wonder about some choices in the build. Don’t think you have quite enough kicker spells to justify the 2x Riptides. If you made some inclusions with the Party mechanic in mind (the Stalker and 2x Protectors), I think it was a mistake to leave the 7/5 artifact in sideboard. Alternatively, you could have focused more on Wizard synergy and run the white 3/3 wizard, the 2 blue instants in sideboard, and prob even Smite the Monstrous since you weren’t heavy on removal and could use extra ways to answer bombs. I think the build could have been more focused.


Hadn't played yet (note the 42 cards in deck). I made some adjustments based on your suggestions and went 3-3. Some of it was undoubtedly due to bad play - I lost one game when I still had a way out, because I was saving my lands to trigger future landfall and didn't notice I didn't have white mana. Other losses were to flyers, surprisingly enough. One opponent had two of the colorless 2/3 flyer that becomes 4/5 with kicker, and I didn't have enough answers.

I certainly have a lot to learn about this format.

Edit: next draft, if you got any suggestions for the build let me know, will play this tomorrow.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 8:51 am 
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It's looking good man. The only thing I can think of is that maybe you want the second hellion over the ascetic (or the Brute). depends on if you really want to stick to the party theme. You could drop the Strength in Solidarity for the pickaxe if you end up dropping the cleric

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 9:34 am 
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Another 3-0 pile
This was a hard draft... I was so depressed with my pile as the draft part was over... but little by little, play by play I was able to see this thing pull it off.

Something among this lines and 1-2 crabs should be super stronk.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 12:03 pm 
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What is your opinion of Jwari Disruption / Jwari Ruins?


I don’t get it. Some people are high on it but I think it’s pretty bad.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 12:31 pm 
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What is your opinion of Jwari Disruption / Jwari Ruins?


Disruption is a fine card, basically an earlygame counterspell that gets into your deck over a land. It's not a terribly high pick and fairly bad as far as flip land effects go, but I'd put a few below it (Beyeen Veil is the worst one to me).

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 2:07 pm 
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Interesting. I’d value Beyeen more cause it’s more useful as a spell late. Better top deck. I’m not sad at all to cast as land early, and I’m ok drawing a trick to mess with combat late. Jwari fights itself in that respect - both modes are better early plays, and both are bad top decks late. Holding up 2 mana for the chance that opp taps out for something isn’t a small ask early.

Idk I just find it a frustrating card. Ya it’s boss when you counter a big play, but more often than not it’s dead in hand. I can accept that people play it. I might run it on occasion. I can’t wrap my head around someone being actively happy to draft it tho

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 4:19 pm 
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I'll play a copy of disruption in every Ux deck, it's not so bad late TBH it's only really bad on top deck wars.
As a general rule you play as much MDFC as you are able. Some of them are P1P1 others more like P5-6 but they will not show up much later than that.

Ruins on the other hand is really hard to build around probably not as versatile as Disruption IMO.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 7:41 pm 
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Maybe I’m too down on it. What got me to post the question was seeing people take it in early streamer access event over what I consider to be strictly better cards because it’s a spell land.

I was watching a recording from that event earlier today and the person took it over Tazeem Roilmage in a UR-splash G (for the UG hydra) kicker deck with spells/wizards subtheme. Person already had a couple copies each of both Into the Roil and Roil Eruption, along with the drake kicker token maker and the 0/5 kicker payoff creature - and *excitedly* took Disruption over the Roilmage. I thought that was a bad pick due to spell land tunnel vision. In the end, it was a 7 win run. It wasn’t like the pick ruined the draft. But, Disruption never countered anything the whole run; it’s most memorable moment was being a slow land drop that put them a turn off of casting a big kicked spell. Roilmage would have def pulled more weight. That’s what motivated me to ask thoughts on the card here.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 11:26 pm 
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P1P1:Nighthawk
end of P1 looking at something wanting to be UB..
P2P3!!!: Felidar retreat!!!!
Sorry Nighthawk the you got the axe!

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B03 Draft is just so good to grind a set I'm loving it!

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2020 11:42 pm 
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Early thoughts. What are your impressions of best/worst archetypes?

I think any color pair can get there. But:

I really like WB, UG, UR best so far. U and B seem very strong. Clerics and Wizards are strong limited tribes. Both tribal artifacts have impressed me more than I expected (I thought wizards could be good but wasn’t high on clerics before seeing it in action). Kicker is strong, and between tempo plays and the beef it doesn’t seem that difficult to get to kick mana.

I like UB, GB, and BR ok. I’ve seen a decent amount of middling rogue builds, which keeps it a tier below the others, but I can easily see that being wrong just from skewed early impressions.

I think UW, GR, GW, and WR are the lower tiers. Landfall as a dedicated mechanic feels not amazing. I like the landfall creatures that buff with counters, but the ones that get a temporary buff kinda suck when you run out of lands in hand. Im feeling like landfall is better when you’re doing it incidentally rather than trying for a focused build. I’m not impressed with dedicated Party so far. Like landfall, incidentally it’s decent, but aiming for the dedicated full party payoffs seems too difficult and you just wind up with a lackluster pool of creatures cause you’re trying to represent all types. I like the BR party decks better than UW because they have better removal imo. Boros builds I’ve encountered miss more than they hit. If they get a good curve they can look nice, but if they stumble at all then most other decks have the mid-late game to stabilize and win out.


I’m curious how other’s impressions may differ based on what you’ve seen.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2020 8:01 am 
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I was watching a recording from that event earlier today and the person took it over Tazeem Roilmage in a UR-splash G (for the UG hydra) kicker deck with spells/wizards subtheme. Person already had a couple copies each of both Into the Roil and Roil Eruption, along with the drake kicker token maker and the 0/5 kicker payoff creature - and *excitedly* took Disruption over the Roilmage. I thought that was a bad pick due to spell land tunnel vision. In the end, it was a 7 win run. It wasn’t like the pick ruined the draft. But, Disruption never countered anything the whole run; it’s most memorable moment was being a slow land drop that put them a turn off of casting a big kicked spell. Roilmage would have def pulled more weight. That’s what motivated me to ask thoughts on the card here.


I'm honestly not too surprised by this pick as I'm fairly low on the Roilmage; I think it's too expensive for what it does. Meanwhile, Disruption is early-game interaction at the opportunity cost of a land slot.
It would kind of depend on context, but I'd pick Disruption over Roilmage most of the time as well; and while Roilmage would've seeminglyy fit his deck, it has diminishing returns with the Into the Roils and Roil Eruptions. I'd need to see the context of the deck to fully judge the pick though. Plus: Keep in mind this is early access; not everything you see here is set in stone.



Early thoughts. What are your impressions of best/worst archetypes?


I'll just note my impressions in order:
-WU: This feels fairly weak to me; mostly because intended mechanic (Party) is done better by other colour pairs.
-UB: Haven't drafted it yet myself; from what I've seen played against me I'm not in love with it. It doesn't deal enough damage and the mill subtheme doesn't go off quick enough.
-BR: I've been really impressed with BR; both playing it myself and playing against it. Best removal meets great tempo plays.
-RG: I've definitely lost to the Landfall Aggro deck. It's tougher to get together than BR because every deck is vying for the good cards, though.
-GW: The more grindy one of the Landfall decks, and it does okay as well. This has even more cards to make sure you're not running out of landdrops.
-WB: You either need the gold cards or the two-card common combo to have this be amazing; if it gets there it is powerful, if not your backdoor is an okay-ish party deck.
-UR: There's powerful stuff here, but you're vying for contested cards. The artifact is in fact amazing, though.
-BG: This either is a slower RB Allies or a grindy +1-counter deck.
-RW: Party is a bit tougher for RW than RB, even if the Warrior subtheme is good.
-GU: Like UR, you're vying for good cards; but it's powerful if it comes together.

If I had to make a tentative ranking I'd probably go RB > UR > GU > WB > GW > BG > RW > RG > UB > WU, with a step down after either of the first four and maybe one after RW.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:39 am 
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I’ve seen Roilmage do Work tho. Format’s pretty slow, and he can get a loop with the modal kicker blue spell. Also the deck had 2x Roil Eruption by the time that pick came up and that’s a strong card to get back - especially with the UG hydra that can copy your kicked spells (that was also in pool at that point). But, your right, it was early access day and peeps were trying out new things.

Ya, I agree the wizard artifact is amazing. I thought it would be pretty good, but it’s looked even better than I thought. The fact it triggers off wizard creature spells too is huge.

Appreciate your pair rankings. Seems we’re not far off in early impressions of top and bottom rankings. I really wanted to love UB, and it can do some fun tricksy things, but it hasn’t looked that strong from what I’ve seen either.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:47 pm 
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To be fair, I mistook Roilmage for Geysermage (the 3/2 with bounce). Roilmage is better, but I'd still have taken Disruption.
Funnily, I believe I watched the draft you mentioned in the meantime (NicolaiBolas on a P3P1, correct?). Definitely an interesting one.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:08 pm 
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Yep. It was Nicolai, and it’s one of the runs he posted to youtube. Pack 3 sounds right, but I think it was couple picks into it. If it was a UR kicker wizard deck, splashing G just for the hydra, and a bunch (7-ish) spell lands, that has to be the one I’m talking about.

Oh, ya, Geysermage is little more meh. Fine fit for the build, but not as eye popping to me if he had taken Disruption over it. Roilmage was made for the deck he had drafted and was reason my eyes popped and motivated me to post about it when he passed it over. Even if you value Disruption over or close to Roilmage in a vacuum, at that point in the draft synergy pushed Roilmage way ahead as the “correct” choice in my eyes.

I’m curious how much more heavy spell land / lower basic land decks will be punished in BO3 without the hand smoother doing work. IIRC he went down to 13 basics for the build. I’m thinking low land count decks like that will be slowed down more noticeably when shuffler isn’t aiding with basics in opening hand. At any rate, I liked the build overall - really attracted to the drake enchantment and wizard synergies. Think kicker and wizards are the archetypes I’m most attracted to (play preference and they’re powerful), and it was cool seeing them work together in the same deck.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2020 6:43 pm 
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I’ve seen a decent amount of middling rogue builds, which keeps it a tier below the others

Modulo wrote:
-UB: Haven't drafted it yet myself; from what I've seen played against me I'm not in love with it. It doesn't deal enough damage and the mill subtheme doesn't go off quick enough.
...
If I had to make a tentative ranking I'd probably go RB > UR > GU > WB > GW > BG > RW > RG > UB > WU, with a step down after either of the first four and maybe one after RW.

Appreciate your pair rankings. Seems we’re not far off in early impressions of top and bottom rankings. I really wanted to love UB, and it can do some fun tricksy things, but it hasn’t looked that strong from what I’ve seen either.


Heh, I think I figured out how UB can be boss. Forget rogues and mill completely; draft a wizard control deck heavy on removal, disruption, and spell recursion. Also 2 wizard artifacts. Lord have mercy how much work that card puts in this run :party: :


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2020 8:36 pm 
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This set is great for control.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 4:18 am 
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I, obviously, have a lot of learning to do. I've gone 2-1 [bo3] with decks that I thought were pure ****, and I've gone 0-3 with deck that I thought would rock the world. This is definitely a fun set to draft. Need to get a better grasp on things. Such wild variation in deck types within colors

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