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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 10:46 am 
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sixty4half wrote:
Y'all seen this new thing they're calling sealioning? LOL people are dumb, that's just classic trolling.


I looked it up. I get the impression it’s a term people use when they don’t want to defend their assertions from questioning :V

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 10:47 am 
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It's not new either. In fact, I think we talked about it here years ago


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:18 pm 
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sixty4half wrote:
Y'all seen this new thing they're calling sealioning? LOL people are dumb, that's just classic trolling.


I looked it up. I get the impression it’s a term people use when they don’t want to defend their assertions from questioning :V


When I reply on a general thread where i don't know people, I will probably respond to requests as described. I am not trying to convince the person I am talking to though, I am aiming towards the rest of the people reading.

Speaking of information, I did a bit of research on masks and such since now we have to wear masks at work if we leave our desks.

Mainly, I am expecting to hear the old Co2 argument and that masks make it hard to breath.

Here is what I found.

CO2 & O2 are about .33 NM (nano meters big)
Corona Virus is 120 NM
N95 filters 300 NM and above

The 300 to 120 gap looks like the filters would not work on CV, but the virus does not just exist on it's own. It travels in the droplets or aerosols we produce when we breath or talk. Those are are least 1000 NM (1 micron) large, and that is what masks actually trap.

Other masks will obviously trap less. But the point is that the filtration is nowhere near the level you would need to stop O2 and CO2, even with a N95.

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:39 pm 
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Science!


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:41 pm 
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science is ghey


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:17 pm 
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Wintervoid wrote:
It travels in the droplets or aerosols we produce when we breath or talk. Those are are least 1000 NM (1 micron) large, and that is what masks actually trap.


Yes, I’ve been on that since like mid-March. The whole #masks4all campaign I was promoting here at the time covered that science. It’s so gd frustrating that science communication is so poor that people still post the stupid memes about your mask being a soccer net to the virus. DROPLETS ARE THE SOCCER BALL AND THE GOAL NET DOES A PRETTY DECENT JOB OF CATCHING THAT YOU IDIOTS

I hate that mask wearing, like everything else in 2020, became politicized.

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:40 pm 
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I hate that mask wearing, like everything else in 2020, became politicized.


You must be a Democrat to post something like that!

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:51 pm 
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So Pepe Mujica retired today from politics in his last moments in the Uruguayan congress he said:

"I got a big share of defects, I'm passionate, but I haven't grown hate in my garden for decades... because I learned a tough lesson that life imposed me... hate makes you stupid... it makes us lose objectivity"...

Mujica had a similar story to Mandela... so his words carries some deeper meaning... they often makes me think...

This weekend we are finally voting the plebiscite to change our constitution... one year ago we lived the most difficult week this little country has lived in the last 40 years and there are still echoes of that explosion of energy that made abundantly clear that things need to change... there's no assurances in where this step will take us... and that is one scary thought... but where ever it takes us... that future can't be built on hate... hate´s moment has passed its energy cannot drive the future... we need to swift gears coz in the following years we will be discussing our social contract .... and we need ti build the bases of our country with objectivity... I really hope that we are up to the challenge as a society...

In any case just wanted to share some thoughts here... US has a big election coming up and I really hope that hate beggins to leave our lives in the foreseeable future.

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 5:20 pm 
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Considering this election is mostly based on hatred for a specific candidate... I don't know Cucho, I think the US has some healing to do.

I blame Trump, but my politics are clearly showing their bias.

Personally, I wish there were a way we could export all of our fringe elements, right and left, the **** out of our country.


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 8:08 pm 
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Healing is something I look forward too, hopefully the process of this new constitution helps in that regards... I think it really should.

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 8:38 pm 
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Wintervoid wrote:
I hate that mask wearing, like everything else in 2020, became politicized.


You must be a Democrat to post something like that!


Haha, idk man, the people who insist everything is political aren’t republicans. Idk what I am anymore. I’m anti-crazy, which apparently leaves me politically homeless in the US :V

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:30 am 
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I'm sure you guys have seen the news article that starts, "The Trump Administration’s faltering response to the coronavirus pandemic has led to anywhere between 130,000 and 210,000 deaths in the United States that could have been prevented, according to a report released Thursday by a team of disaster preparedness experts." by now.

I was wondering, does anyone know where to find the actual report? And who these 'disaster preparedness experts" are? All I can find is the news article and there are no links or references. They're claiming 60-95% of deaths were avoidable.... the high end seems sus


edit: Based on the last two paragraphs, "The research team compared the US response to the policies in other countries. If the US had followed the policies and protocols of Australia, as few as 11,699 people may have died, the report estimates.

Following Japan’s policies would have led to as few as 4,315 deaths in the US, the Columbia team calculated. Even France did better and had the US followed France’s lead, 162,240 Americans would have died -- around 60,000 fewer than the current total.
" it seems that they were trying to take other countries infection % and death % and tried to apply those to US population. Doesn't seem like a rock solid way to glean information as there are so many other factors to consider. Did Australia/France/Japan go through the same social issues that the US went through during the pandemic? Are there other factors like mean pop age? Populations pre-disposition to other health issues (obesity, diabetes, any auto-immune issues)? Pop density? Anti-maskers? Massive Protests?

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 7:56 am 
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I was thinking early on that even if the US has a "bad" response to the virus vis-a-vis statistical evidence compared to other countries, i don't think it's like America to learn from it and make real tangible efforts to reduce the impact next time. I see you guys as making a gun control type response, "nono, US is different, we have mass shootings because we are different and you can't really fix that" to apply to this, "nono, we have anti-maskers (as does every country), protests (as does every country) and fat people so you can't really prevent a pandemic from breaking out over here cuz we're the US and we're different than all you guys"

Either that or having a strategy for pandemics will be deemed a political thing and will get dismissed by half the population maybe.

maybe I'm wrong, but i think that's how it'll go down. Or if any actual real measures DO get put into place. They will be dismantled and unfunded next time Republicans gain control of government in however many years but before the next pandemic.

I think a Biden government would form a new (former) group that hopefully works with private industry to come up with meaningful strategies be put in place that can be executed when future novel viruses pop up


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:07 am 
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A little overboard on the reaction? Or were you going for the "hot take" version?

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:36 am 
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Thé second thing


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:56 am 
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sixty4half wrote:
I'm sure you guys have seen the news article that starts, "The Trump Administration’s faltering response to the coronavirus pandemic has led to anywhere between 130,000 and 210,000 deaths in the United States that could have been prevented, according to a report released Thursday by a team of disaster preparedness experts." by now.

I was wondering, does anyone know where to find the actual report? And who these 'disaster preparedness experts" are? All I can find is the news article and there are no links or references. They're claiming 60-95% of deaths were avoidable.... the high end seems sus



I can't even find the news article, the only report i've been able to find has been the Pandemic Playbook and some stuff about about Operation Dark Winter

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 11:42 am 
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sixty4half wrote:
I'm sure you guys have seen the news article that starts, "The Trump Administration’s faltering response to the coronavirus pandemic has led to anywhere between 130,000 and 210,000 deaths in the United States that could have been prevented, according to a report released Thursday by a team of disaster preparedness experts." by now.

I was wondering, does anyone know where to find the actual report? And who these 'disaster preparedness experts" are? All I can find is the news article and there are no links or references. They're claiming 60-95% of deaths were avoidable.... the high end seems sus


edit: Based on the last two paragraphs, "The research team compared the US response to the policies in other countries. If the US had followed the policies and protocols of Australia, as few as 11,699 people may have died, the report estimates.

Following Japan’s policies would have led to as few as 4,315 deaths in the US, the Columbia team calculated. Even France did better and had the US followed France’s lead, 162,240 Americans would have died -- around 60,000 fewer than the current total.
" it seems that they were trying to take other countries infection % and death % and tried to apply those to US population. Doesn't seem like a rock solid way to glean information as there are so many other factors to consider. Did Australia/France/Japan go through the same social issues that the US went through during the pandemic? Are there other factors like mean pop age? Populations pre-disposition to other health issues (obesity, diabetes, any auto-immune issues)? Pop density? Anti-maskers? Massive Protests?


This kind of thing borders on stupid, you are right to question it.

It's extra stupid because, by making a terrible argument (and for the record, the statistics they are using to justify their claims are beyond ridiculous. These guys wouldn't make it out of the first course in an upper level statistics program with this kind of reasoning), they lend credence to the idea that America did nothing wrong - this is patently false.

Barney is correct to point out the US's deficiencies, but this article does a terrible job of implying the obvious fact that the US could have probably done better. If anything, this manipulation of data will serve to call that obvious fact into question.

This reminds of the blatantly stupid study that suggested, months ago, that the protests were not likely to increase the spread of COVID-19.

Yet again, some incompetent jackasses have released a set of claims that are so obviously false as to undermine the reasonable arguments that might have been made.


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 12:07 pm 
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I agree those numbers are way off. We ARE doing poorly compared to almost any other nation that is not in South America, but those numbers are insane.

Now, if you compare us to Italy, for example, we would have about 10% less deaths if we had the same deaths per 100k. I am NOT saying that is a fair comparison, but I think it would be hard to argue that we had more challenges then Italy, which was pretty much ground zero for the CV in Europe.

On the other hand, we are better off then Spain and Belgium.

TBH, the USA I grew up in I would have expected us to lead the pack in effectiveness instead of trail behind near the back of the pack. We were the nation that came together for WW2, we beat Russia to the moon, we led the charge into the information age. We were world leaders, and now we are the hermit yelling "Get off my lawn!"

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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 12:37 pm 
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Yeah I didn’t mean to sound like I was defending the article, I find it flawed as well and a little easy


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 Post subject: Re: Off Topic Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:06 pm 
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A Cybersecurity Expert gained access to Trump’s Twitter account last week by guessing his password. This is the second time this expert has gained access to Trump’s account. The first time back in 2016 the pw was “yourefired” and the second time it was “Maga2020!”.

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